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On low sec and mission whining (WAY TL;DR for most of you)

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Maximillian Bayonette White Lion Manufacture and Salvage	Posted - 2008.08.23 08:32:00 - [1] Originally by: SurrenderMonkey PIRATES JUST WANT TARGETS!!! repeated 5000 times Long post. Basically the same erroneous assumptions repeated again and again. 1/10.
Maximillian Bayonette White Lion Manufacture and Salvage	Posted - 2008.08.23 09:30:00 - [2] Edited by: Maximillian Bayonette on 23/08/2008 09:30:35 Originally by: AB 2006 The best post on this yet, well done. While it's certainly the case that it isn't only the pirates who are whinging about level 4s, it is largely pirates who are. Because of that, of course we're going to impute motivation based on your chosen playstyle. Sorry, that's how the world works. Human beings are rarely, if ever, taking "an objective position", most especially when they claim to be doing so. Your whining and complaining is properly imputed to your own chosen playstyle, at the end of the day, despite all of your numerous protestations to the contrary. Some of us are just astute enough to see this -- get over it. Not one of your more prominent qualities I'm afraid. Especially since you can't see the problems with level 4 missions in high sec on their own merits, but have to continuously try to read some kind of ulterior motive in any such claim.
Maximillian Bayonette White Lion Manufacture and Salvage	Posted - 2008.08.23 10:46:00 - [3] Originally by: Carniflex Disability to read what OP has written do not make it go away. Even when trying to dismiss it as one line whine. If there is 'erroneous assumptions' as you claim it would serve better to point them out and show why it is not so. And not some out of context partial sentences but the claims as whole. You are correct. It is not my disability to read the OP that makes it go away. It's the fact that what the OP has written is a bunch of assumptions regarding ulterior motives for those of us who are asking for nerfs. They have been pointed out and refuted numerous times in other threads. The problem is, some people just can't accept that there are people who just wants the game to be better for EVERYONE and who don't have any ulterior motives. With regards to what he writes apart from branding the nerf supporters with the 'griefer' brush, he could make his arguments shorter. I'm not saying this because I'm unable to read them. I've read war and peace. I can read overly long pieces of text with no problem. The problem is that if he expects anyone to actually debate with him, he should fit his arguments into a single post in easy to quote bullet points. It's just common sense and respect shown to your reader. The wall-of-text approach is often used to hide weak or erroneous arguments. This is one of those occasions.
Maximillian Bayonette White Lion Manufacture and Salvage	Posted - 2008.08.23 13:20:00 - [4] Originally by: Shadowsword The OP is right. No.
Maximillian Bayonette White Lion Manufacture and Salvage	Posted - 2008.08.23 15:23:00 - [5] Originally by: ShardowRhino First off, most of the people posting about this topic are foaming at the mouth and make absolutely no sense. None of them can give a straight answer as to WHY they actually need to nerf L4s . No one I have seen has suggested what the outcome will be other then "more people will be forced to 0.0 and lowsec" in order to make decent isk. Also since no one is able to give a straight answer and reason why the nerf is needed, those of us that have the brain power to go over possible reasons why they are calling for the nerf are left with nothing more then 2 possible reasons. 1. people are mad about the gank and nano nerf and looking to take things out on others. 2.people want more easy targets to shoot at. If there are very good reasons for the cry for a nerf, they are nowhere to be seen. If there are so many people crying for a nerf they should all have at least some resemblance to the original ideas. What we do see suggests that people are in fact looking for nothing more then easy targets. IF there are good reasons for the cry,you and everyone else is failing HARD at making your point. If you want to push an agenda along you can't let your points fall to the bottom of the pile of shit. You guys make it easier for us to butcher your call for nerf by assuming we are going to bother digging up YOUR reasons. If you cant be assed to post it when ever you need to then why should we bother? We don't want the nerf, we think its moronic and without good reason. But by all means allow your "valid" reasons to remain at the bottom of the horse shit. Seriously t2 goods are dropping in price all the time. Even if they were to stabalize they are very affordable. This means both 0.0,lowsec pirates and empire players can afford them and not feel the sting to hard. With FW out, theres a lot more pewpewing going on then before. Since there is more death and destruction taking place due to FW and prices for t2 dropping, things would be pretty good for all players in eve. More people are able to get into pvp and go t2 when they can do L4s. Those players can then move to 0.0 if they ever get the itch. Also i laughed when i read people saying "inflation" when they should have been saying anything but "inflation". But by all means, those crying nerf keep your best material at the bottom of the pile of shit the rest of you throw out. It makes it easier for us to rip things apart. To the OP, GG on the thread. This is an amazing post. You've basically summed up why this debate isn't goint anywhere. It's because YOU CAN'T READ! There have been tons of explanations of WHY lvl 4 missions should be nerfed/moved. That you chose not to read them is your problem. You are also confused enough to actually believe everything getting cheaper is good for the game. Hint: It really isn't. For one, it's a huge nerf to piracy. For a second, it makes death meaningless. For a third, it makes people with safe isk prints more competitive than people without safe isk prints, i.e., those who can't run missions in high sec because of sec status. Your post is basically the epitome of fail, and you should feel ashamed for having posted it.
Maximillian Bayonette White Lion Manufacture and Salvage	Posted - 2008.08.23 15:38:00 - [6] Edited by: Maximillian Bayonette on 23/08/2008 15:38:54 Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: SurrenderMonkey Originally by: Maximillian Bayonette Originally by: SurrenderMonkey Radical new concept: It's possible to care about an issue without having a (direct) personal stake in its outcome. No, according to your OP it's not possible. No where did I say that. People generally are selfish and tend to only interested where they're personally affected, yes. Since this is about missions, and I'm obviously not a mission runner, it's pretty clearly different. I do run missions, and i think they're due a nerf. I also run missions and I think they need a severe nerf. How do you like them apples? /Edit: To answer your follow up question - YES, as my primary source of income.
Maximillian Bayonette White Lion Manufacture and Salvage	Posted - 2008.08.23 16:26:00 - [7] You are both vegans I presume?
Maximillian Bayonette White Lion Manufacture and Salvage	Posted - 2008.08.23 16:40:00 - [8] Originally by: Joar Mendar I am, I can't speak for Myra... Why? You have that smug sense of self-satisfaction over you. Common among vegans. Comes from not finishing your sausages.
Maximillian Bayonette White Lion Manufacture and Salvage	Posted - 2008.08.24 08:02:00 - [9] Originally by: Cpt Branko Edited by: Cpt Branko on 24/08/2008 04:52:39 Originally by: Cassandra Valieries You might wanna take a look in another forum btw where it seems that I'll put a couple of hours of RL earnings into something usefull Oooh, mercs, fun fun Ah, well. Time for our wallets to do the talking then? TELL ME ABOUT THE WAR I DEMAND TO KNOW ABOUT THE WAR!!! Doctor Forum alt VS Captain Pirate Match of the decade.
Maximillian Bayonette White Lion Manufacture and Salvage	Posted - 2008.08.24 12:23:00 - [10] I earn 200 dollars each time I pass go and a lot more if someone lands on my hotel.
Maximillian Bayonette White Lion Manufacture and Salvage	Posted - 2008.08.24 12:49:00 - [11] Originally by: Solomunio Kzenig Edited by: Solomunio Kzenig on 24/08/2008 12:45:46 Oh i love the emo rage....anyway back to Low Sec etc. (what the thread is supposed to be about). Forget trying to nerf people into Low Sec, its not going to happen period. CCP knows where the majority of their player base is and its in High Sec and its not going to cut off that flow of $$'s by **ing them off. Or... CCP realises that the reason for so many of the players being in high sec is because it's too profitable compared to low sec. The logical way of correcting this would be to nerf the rewards of high sec. Originally by:** Solomunio Kzenig Also you do know how many 0.0 alliance members have High Sec alts that run lvl4's to fund their PvP right? you do know this? These are the players CCP devotes most of its time and effort to (the so called 'end-game' players) and CCP is not going to **** them off aswell by nerfing High Sec. Comparisons to RL are just lame; its a game of internet spaceships. The thing is, we do realise this, and we have listed this as a big part of the problem. Safe isk is generated in high sec to fun killing other players in battle grounds. That's what the whole mess is being turned into. I don't want battlegrounds in Eve. I want an integrated game play. That's why I want a nerf.
Maximillian Bayonette White Lion Manufacture and Salvage	Posted - 2008.08.24 13:59:00 - [12] Originally by: Solomunio Kzenig Edited by: Solomunio Kzenig on 24/08/2008 13:55:21 Even if CCP nerf'ed High Sec money making in Lvl4's, the majority of players WOULD NOT head to Low Sec to run lvl4's, they would just step down to Lvl3's and grind them instead. The bulk of the pouplation in High Sec is happy there and don't want to engage in PvP, or are Low Sec/0.0 alts engaged in various money making schemes. FW is a belated attempt by CCP to adress this in a relatively safe way for these players i.e. they can be eased into PvP in relatively cheap ships. These are all assumptions that are disproved by the fact that low sec was more populated when the rewards where higher. After the several nerfs low sec has suffered, of course no one wants to go there anymore. After the several boosts high sec has gotten, of course no one feels inclined to leave. Originally by: Solomunio Kzenig Also on a personal note: I'm engaged in FW and the Low Sec area's were are flying through are devoid of other Low Sec players/pirates, they have buggerd outta the FW area's casue the noob blobs killed them. TBH OP and his ilk don't want PvP, they want to gank Faction PvE fit Ravens for ISk and e-peen. Do you find it strange that pirates, who normally run solo or in small gangs, find it prudent to leave when 50 noobs show up with crap fitted T1 ships? There's no reason for the pirates to engage, because the loot is crap, and when so severely outblobbed it's no fun either. The rest of the quoted part shows how little you actually know.
Maximillian Bayonette White Lion Manufacture and Salvage	Posted - 2008.08.24 16:35:00 - [13] Originally by: Drunk Driver NERF LEVEL 4 MISSIONS SO PEOPLE WILL FLY INTO LOW SEC TO BE GANKED! DO IT! DO IT NOW! . So you're out of arguments against a nerf and have resorted to some kind of misguided reverse psychology?
Maximillian Bayonette White Lion Manufacture and Salvage	Posted - 2008.08.24 16:40:00 - [14] Originally by: Ruze Dude, that's just DD's way. He's, like ... a drunk driver. Crashes into your post, kills some innocent idea, then forgets about it in the morning. Can't really hold it against him, as he doesn't know what he does. It's just that I hate reverse psychology 'cause I always fall for it. Don't nerf high sec level 4 missions, btw.

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